Unknown 0:00 registry matters is an independent production. The opinions and ideas here are that of the hosts and do not reflect the opinions of any other organization. If you have a problem with these thoughts FYI p recording live from FTP studios, east and west and transmitting across the internet. This is Episode 66 of registry matters. Happy Saturday, Larry, how are you Unknown 0:21 doing? Fantastic. Oh my god, you're fantastic. What's wrong? Unknown 0:26 Well, I'm having a great time. Unknown 0:29 You're usually kind of an old curmudgeon. And you're like Whoa, I guess I'm okay I'm still here. The legislature said full swing says it's exciting a balanced life you know you don't you don't understand that I do know that about you that this is pretty much all you live for. And like if you step back to the 30,000 foot level that all the stuff that's going on in in with the politics at the federal level right now has got to be just like you're running around a candy store with free range. Unknown 1:00 At the moment Unknown 1:01 is the best time to be alive. I can only imagine. And you were you were you were post spawn when? When Nixon was around, right? Unknown 1:11 Oh, next I go back to the, to the link and administration Unknown 1:17 now. Now remind me of one thing though. We had talked about this earlier, and I was going to, I'm going to bring that up, and I was going to, Unknown 1:23 you know, won't be about faucets and it won't be about cars. What was the thing that I was going to ask you about? I don't remember Me neither. I think you're just saying that so you don't want me picking on you? Unknown 1:34 Well, we have a new patron there Unknown 1:37 we do. We do. We have a patron named Robert and he's at the supported level. So he's a rich mF. If you need anything in your locker box, go to Robert Robert can occupy soups or you know chili packets or anything like that Unknown 1:51 but it's a supporter level supported level I mean, not support over the supported level Unknown 1:56 it is I think, $15 Yeah, we have Unknown 2:00 What we have, what the new level where you put the growth of your paycheck that we have Unknown 2:07 this isn't that level this isn't that level. Unknown 2:10 That's the advised level. Unknown 2:14 But so far we haven't had any takers at either of those channels. I can't even fathom why that is a thing. Like, why nobody's taking us up on it. We should just have people lining up at the door and they can't get in. Unknown 2:25 I don't see a problem with it myself. I do want to take a moment and just say to all of the patrons, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so very much. It is incredibly appreciated. And then to all of our listeners to Yeah, yeah, we'd like you to Unknown 2:42 have we have our favorites that we really like. And then we like everybody though, but Yes, that is correct. Well, let's get things started. Go in it. Let me make a personal announcement to one of our listeners to Charles Unknown 2:56 Charles in New York. Okay, Charles and Charles in New York. Unknown 3:00 We were looking at yeah we're looking forward to having Charles at the conference he one from an arsenal on a on a on a Unknown 3:11 conference call he was I remember that he's indicated he's going to attend this year and we're we're looking forward to having him and I will be able to fly he has he has visual impairments but I have no doubt will be able to find okay a chaperone that will help him navigate around the hotel leave it so like a 12 story Hotel 1213 stories but we will be able to help him get probably I have no doubt that we would be able to find a chaperone. Did you know that person to be of assistance to him, Unknown 3:48 but we'll find someone who will who will help Charles get around Unknown 3:52 and look forward to having him there. And then I sent him an email telling me to call the hotel book, it's reservation and anybody who books the reservation, just remember Unknown 4:00 You if you book your hotel rooms, they don't charge you to have a credit card or debit card number, but it holds the reservation. But there's no actual assessment for the lodging until you check out. And unlike us at and parcel, we're going to, we're going to get your registration money before you check out because probably people wouldn't pay if you if you collect it all the way out. Unknown 4:24 Yeah. Hey, do you know? Okay, since you're from the Lincoln administration, do you remember a little rascals episode where they said pay as you leave? I don't remember that. No, they did. Unknown 4:34 They did one of their little plays. And I don't remember the whole storyline. But anyway, so you know, they would always do their little plays and alfalfa and darlin, whatever. And somehow I remember the title of the episode well, so you can pay as you leave. So they did something in the program where they got everybody in there, and they did something that they were just so anxious to drop off their nickels and quarters as they went out the door. But I can still remember I can still remember at least one cabinet member from Lincoln administration Secretary of War Edward Edward not Unknown 5:00 Edward Edward, where you at his confirmation hearing. Unknown 5:04 I was at when when the assassination took place at Ford's Theatre Unknown 5:10 sector stat and put out orders in terms of how to deal with with the situation. I was on his strategy team to. Unknown 5:21 We're the Strategy Team. Unknown 5:24 All right then. Well, Unknown 5:27 we received an email message from Carl. Unknown 5:30 That's why I said that. That's why I said that my favorite country singer died. He was probably 91 Yes, that in context with my age, he was quite a youngster. Yes, that's a young whippersnapper from your context, right? That's correct. Unknown 5:45 Well, Carl says, I've been listening to the show for a short time. Very good job. I'm in Texas. And there are two issues I would like to discuss. One is would you say it is true that the government gets away with some of the bad laws because most of the people on the registry are low income I was convicted in 1998. Unknown 6:00 went to prison for five years did it day for day before I went in I was low risk when I came out I was high risk in 2010 I went back to prison for failure to register I did all but five months when I got out I was low risk again by the time I got off parole I was back to high risk How can they keep changing me like that all I've done is try to find a job in a place to live anyway Keep up the great work and thanks well thank you Carl. Larry tell us what you think about Carl's question I don't know if I'm going to be qualified to answer that that entire question the the system does does feed on poor people that that suck all across the board though it runs the gamut from traffic tickets to biter Mr. Peters so to me that it's it's it's a cash cow and so i would i would agree that that that first part of his question that that they do get away with a lot of stuff from poor people and for Bernie Sanders said a week or so ago that for folks don't vote Unknown 7:00 You remember that and he's taken a lot of heat for saying that that that he said poor people don't vote he said he says you're not picking on his New England accent or you and and the reality is that for a variety of reasons some of them are logistical and barriers are in place to voting if you if you don't have transportation reliable transportation that can be a barrier if you don't have identification in the states this current you can have your identification lapse for a variety of reasons to be imprisoned till I mean I think you guys can relate to people whose ID expires when you when you're in prison. And then you end up coming out you end up having a lot of costs associated with trying to get the documentation because suddenly even though it's your picture on there, you're not the same person anymore and I've never felt I had to redo my whole drivers to do the motor vehicle tax That's crazy. ever understood how if identification is supposed to we're getting off topic from what is question we're gonna get back to the second but I've never understood Unknown 8:00 How if the photograph is you and it expired yesterday if it expired February 28 two days ago how you magically become someone else on March 1 or second if you look at the picture as long as that was issued by governmental entity and your briefly sure that's not a fraudulent ID, why is it no longer acceptable to identify you because it's not it's not currently enforce but it's still you it shows you it has your name on it and that's one of the things I want to change at our state law here which I'm not gonna be able to get it done this year but when you go to the grocery store here you will get carded even if you're my age because it says data that that I'm a licensed alcohol distributor Unknown 8:48 shall constitute a sale to a person who cannot produce a valid ID but that the retailer takes that to be the you shall impose that record Unknown 9:00 Part of on everyone. Well, that's not what it says. It says to a part of a person who cannot produce but I believe that leaves open the opportunity for you not to have to person if you don't believe an idea is necessary if you if they look like they're 80 years old and the legal age is 21, they could have produced it had you wanted it, but you didn't deem it necessary. But if you can't hear you have to. And then if the idea is expired, they said, Well, I can't sell too well, it's not a valid idea. So the law says valid ID well, do I magically magically become someone else Unknown 9:32 But back to his point you were no longer valid The day after you are no longer valid human it can be for poor people not voting. That can be a number of barriers that that that order folks that don't have those challenges would not understand but the politicians understand it because they do great analyses of who votes of where their votes come from, and where their votes don't come from. They look at precinct to precinct and they figure out of the voters the demographics of where they're going to get votes from, to win the requisite not Unknown 10:00 for their particular race so so how would say that he's correct Carl's corrected that that has has a significant waiting on what gets done to people because people who don't push back are more likely to have things done that have you noticed how effective the American Association for retired persons are they RP Unknown 10:18 they are very very prolific and very active. Yes I noticed the National Rifle Association Yes, they are also like they're probably the biggest lobby is that fair? I think I think AARP is bigger, but they're both very powerful groups and those people will turn out vote if you if you were to if you were to pull either of those memberships you'll see that there turn out as above average if a person is a member of AARP they're very likely to vote in numbers that are greater than the populations turn out you did the same thing with the NRA card carrying nra members they're going to vote it and number so when you when you're when you're dealing with was politics itself Unknown 11:00 about getting votes. I mean, I know it breaks people's heart for me to tell you that, but our system requires you to have the majority of the votes to get it office. So when you're out trying to get votes, that's what you're in for. It's a contest to get more votes than your opponent. I mean, it's really not that complicated and right. And the other part is question I don't know that I'm qualified to answer because I didn't study on the Texas risk system in terms of how they, how they do it. Probably a good thing would be for Carl to speak to an attorney who actually does practice in Texas, and there are a number of them and events such as large a third number of people who try to navigate that process, but it's, I would say, just off the cuff. It's one of those fallacies of a risk based system people that don't understand how flawed those systems are. And I would I would be guessing that there's probably some arbitrary and capricious so he's probably not able to exercise whatever remedies are might be a challenge these days. Unknown 12:00 ratings that hands up getting stuck with a higher rating but I don't know enough to feel qualified to say how it keeps changing and what his recourses one one thing I'll just add is just in I think it was even this morning I was listening to a podcast on a program called today explained and they said the title of it is called your money is under arrest and they talked about how poor people just end up in this virtuous cycle of the police target you you carry cash because you don't have a bank account and they can just like they can arrest your your money even though there's no crime but like you're carrying 1000 bucks and like well you must be doing something illegal if you've got 1000 bucks cash on you have to be I mean of course right minded person carrying that kind of cash around so you have to get to know good absolutely so as part of your first statement in there about the making bad laws because people on the register low income It is not just people on the register, low income people that are low income face this sort of hurdle anyway, so there's a there's a link in the show notes for that. Let's see that Unknown 13:00 That sounds telling Carl that Yes it does. It does bear into the decision making when when constituencies come to your whining laws, Unknown 13:10 there's an analysis done in terms of where the push backs going to be in, the stronger the push back the more likely you are not to succeed and getting bad laws passed. But on the registry stuff there's just not a lot of pushback the registry community doesn't have a lot of allies and the registrants themselves are not very well organized and and that's very challenging to try to push back with the limited resources that are out there pushing back Unknown 13:38 and then we received another email message that I won't even I don't even think I should mention the person's name Unknown 13:44 but talking about your position on the separation of powers Do you want to do you want to cover this one I don't think I've had enough time to fully digest email it was quite lengthy I read the right one is this and that the long one you sent me middle there? Yeah, I'm Unknown 14:00 Yeah, it is it is. Unknown 14:01 So do you want to not do it? Unknown 14:04 I wanted to give you a chance to defend your position because I, I feel that the position that was stated about how you think of things is wrong. I actually started going through and like answering the email message, but I figured we would just covered on the podcast that you are either in favor or not in favor of judicial activism. And the way that I was trying to explain it back is that Unknown 14:27 people that are on the left when judges go and make a decision that impacts than the people on the right go, Hey, well, that's judicial activism we don't want that we have separation of powers and it happens on the other side. So when the people on the right when the justices on the right make some some sort of decision, the people on the left go after them to and depending on your bent on that subject, you either do or you don't want the judges to intervene. We have the separation of powers and all this. That's what he was going through and talking about unconstitutional laws and you have said Unknown 15:00 repeatedly, laws are assumed to be constitutional when they are put in place. And until we go back and challenge them, they are constitutional. And then we even did a whole episode that was called the justices are not roving tribunals so they're not actually running around trying to find laws that would be unconstitutional. They just are there when we bring the cases to them, and then they judge on them when it happens. Unknown 15:26 Well, I've got the email message now and it's not as long as I thought it was I must together continues, but he says SCOTUS, a pro SCOTUS appropriately struck down that was unconstitutional I guess it's talk about Brown versus Board of Education Yeah, even though it was properly past Well, it will help try to clarify my position Unknown 15:46 I I have not really I don't think played my hand completely in terms of judicial activism. I have played devil's advocate about rice what I try to do on the on the program Unknown 16:00 To get people to take an amber look at themselves because I realize I'm talking largely to a conservative audience and they are the ones who generally rant and rail against judicial activism that they don't want into legislating from the bench. And so when I make the comments on make here without play my own position without revealing mom position like on the Nebraska case, we've talked about repeatedly Unknown 16:27 the majority of our listeners are going to fall into the conservatives camp who believes that they think they believe in Unknown 16:35 strict interpretation, right? I'm saying okay, this is what you got, you should be happy with it. This is exactly what you got was that with the decision that the Supreme Court rendered that's going to potentially win the status by lifted there's another stay in place, according to Hank now, but eventually that's going to be lifted because that's what the state gets to do. They get they get to decide how Unknown 17:00 interpret their own state law if there's not a federal constitutional violation and so so I'm really big on devils the devil's advocate and then I contrast that with the federal district court judge cough who took a more interventionist approach trying to read between the lines and figure out what a good public policy is hate hate hate hate, but looked at it differently from a policy perspective that says Nebraska doesn't register in state convicted you but else did it stands to reason they wouldn't want to register out of state but they didn't say that right right. And and so Unknown 17:35 I'm really trying to do a lot of devil's advocate here a lot of us tend to be very inconsistent in our views when it's pointed out to us I got an email from a constituent up the senators who who she's she claims to be a fiscal conservative Unknown 17:53 and she claims to be something that she's not she's asked for a 6% Unknown 18:00 Raise cost of living raise for people who get who get who are under our Public Employees Retirement System she's a retired public employee she wants to 6% instant raised she wants to remove the cola capita cost of living allowance cap which they have trying to save the para system that the Public Employees Retirement System because long term it has more obligations and it has anticipated revenue and she's she's she's saying don't raise any taxes because there's some text enhanced proposals here in the state legislature pending right now and then she's saying that she wants more funding for the university athletics which that lead apartment is in free fall because they're so that teams are so successful that attendance is dried up and sponsorship is down she's asking for all this government spending and then she's she's she's saying that she's a fiscal conservatism wants to wants no taxes. What I do is I call people out on that and I asked them how can you have it both ways? Unknown 18:58 How can you not that Unknown 19:00 Not that you're necessarily picking a side. But if you're trying to say, Hey, we need to get these raises, well, how are you going to pay for it? It pick one side or the other, you can't straddle the fence and have people get more money without then also increasing the revenue side to support it. Absolutely. Right. There's there's, there's a board member of another national organization that advocates she had that discussion, I think they get three public retirement check. And she said, I'm entitled to these checks do we work for we would have gotten them in the private sector as well. Maybe you would have maybe you wouldn't have depending on where you work in the private sector does not the conversation I'm having with you, the conversation I'm having with you is how can you constantly suppress tax revenue and what the benefit that you have your hand out for because someone has to pay the taxes for that unless you have the federal government which they just run huge deficit year after year. But but but states have to balance their budgets. And so I'm attempting to get people to do thinking and to take a look at themselves and say, am I being inconsistent and I'll catch Unknown 20:00 confessed my inconsistency. I've done that on the podcast about about state preemption of local control. Well, I profess to be a big believer in state preemption because like a matter of registry, residency restrictions, proximity restrictions that local communities, we prohibited those two state preemption. But magically, I believe in cities being able to have a higher minimum wage because I'm for a minimum wage increase, and we can't seem to get it to federal level. And we've had trouble getting at the state level, because our previous governor vetoed every increase, regardless of how small so magically, I'll do a flip flop on that. Well, that's me being an inconsistent person. Unknown 20:39 I don't mind you call him out mine consistency also, but I don't think I'd being inconsistent. So on separation of powers, because I really haven't been clear of where I stand. Yeah, that's kind of how I felt. I felt that I feel that you are constantly you, you are in a position on a very regular basis where you're talking to constituents or you're talking to the representatives Unknown 21:00 Senators, congressmen and you have to be able to present these arguments to them in a way that they can Unknown 21:07 can digest it. Unknown 21:09 But the final sentence of the question of the email says, I would like to hear Larry explain why he thinks legislature seems to have more power than the other branches. And I totally don't think that you represent it this way. But it may have come across this way. Unknown 21:23 Well, they have a different set of powers that they through through our to our evolution of our of our of our democratic process. They have a different set of powers that the, the other branches, the legislature's do laws, laws have to be enacted through a legislative process. Unknown 21:47 So like when people say, well, Obama signed international Megan's Law but he did sign it but that it was buying or the crowd that passed it Unknown 21:55 if Obama could never have enacted it without without without the lights. Unknown 22:00 side of process, we get into the we should get into another philosophical debate about overreaching executive orders because some of those may or may not be constitutional. But but the legislature has a different set of powers. The courts have have have a set of powers that are defined in terms of the administration of justice. And in terms of reviewing legislative actions that are challenged, the legislature has enormous power because they are presumed to enact constitutional laws. The presumption goes in their favor, I don't make that rule. I'm just relaying what the what the what the what the judicial system has decided to defer to the legislature on every neck but imprisonments constitutional until a challenging party presents clearing convincing evidence. That is not it's not Larry's rule. That's the courts rules. Unknown 22:52 You can look at Broderick versus Oklahoma where the US Supreme Court clearly articulate that standard and Unknown 23:00 So that that legislature has a lot of power. If people gain access to a majority of those seats, and they're willing to push the envelope and enact legislation that may not be constitutional. Unknown 23:13 And it will, until the court is is presented with a challenge, those laws can operate with impunity because they're presumed constitutional. Now interestingly enough in our state we have a debate right now about sheriff's are saying that they're not going to enforce some sub sub expanded background checks on guns. They're saying that they're not going to enforce that well the sheriff's are wrong for one simple reason. The law if it is passed, it hasn't passed. But if it is passed, it is presumed constitutional. Now the shares can run file a lawsuit right away if they want to and seek an injunction and they can say we can't enforce this. We don't believe it's constitutional. But until you get that injunction or until a court says it's not constitutional, your job is to enforce it. Now, you may give it a low priority within your budget, but your job is to Unknown 24:00 enforce that law and it's not your determination. You're wearing a badge and a gun. You're not wearing a row and you do not hold judicial office. It's not for you to determine what's constitutional. Unknown 24:14 All right, then got 8000 articles to cover. Are you ready? Yeah, let's do it. Let's do it. Alright, this first one is a struggle to understand up front. But so New York courts.gov is the article and says Unknown 24:29 the synopsis I guess would be a guy was convicted of a crime like attempted burglary in the secondary and I think there was a sexual component back in the 90s and then gets a later conviction Unknown 24:44 and sentenced to 12 years and so in 2016 by have this right he he gets he commits another crime that's unrelated. But then when it gets out because he had a sex crime way back in the day, then they say that, hey, you're under sex offender supervision, and you have all these other restrictions that go along with it. Unknown 25:01 Did I do halfway? Okay, if you did a fine job that's exactly that's what it's that's what it's about. And that this is a problem. Why? Unknown 25:11 Well, it's a problem because the the Unknown 25:16 New York the New York courts are kind of organized strange but I don't fully understand it. But I can tell you that the trial court upheld the Department of Corrections or whatever they call their probation supervision. They they put that condition on the individual he was not been released from prison for a sexual offence conviction he has been released from prison for another type of conviction and they said well according to the law it says if we're releasing a level three and York has a risk based system that we have to put all these restrictions on you are a level three Archie. What Yes. What that's what the law says yes. Well, then we're doing our job. Yes. And he said, Well, no, because I'm not been released for a sec space. I said well, don't tell us your Unknown 26:00 albums your level three offender we're releasing you from President and you will comply with these conditions or will lock you up Unknown 26:07 and he challenged out and and the the the highest court has said released the highest court that's reviewed it so far has said they agree with have another trial level Court upheld the department the trial level corporate appears to be called a Supreme Court but the Supreme Court is not the Supreme Court in terms of what we think that looks like the highest court in New York is the Court of Appeals but the the trial level court said corrections has it right the supervisor has already type it right and the appellate review court said nope you don't have it right he does not he does qualify and we read black letter differently we believe we read it that the things that these conditions apply if he's been released from prison for a sexual offense the reason why this is important is because states all over the country take that position Unknown 26:54 so model have an older sex offense so they may have had a sex offense that even Unknown 27:00 Doesn't encompass registration because it was so old I don't have my estate and they'll they'll pick up something a different type of charge and they'll put them under section under supervision now they don't they don't required to register because they're not within the zone okay registry law but I put them under sex offender supervision which is all the traditions of curfew polygraph treat but yeah and all the restrictions around a big boy you sample my sex offense was in 1987 they said well don't tell us your problems you have you have a special need because you've committed a sex offense 30 years ago but I'm being released for burglary don't tell us your problems well what I like about this case is I'm going to try to use it to go be the backup on mine now we're a state Supreme Court state highest tribunal has said I believe escape from the highest tribunal said you can't do it that way you must be releasing the person for for a sex offense to impose this type of restrictions on on him so too bad so sad. You can't do it. Unknown 28:01 Um, is this a function of just like the left hand, not knowing what the right hand is doing? Is that how does this something like this get fixed? Or is it something even to be fixed? Oh, is that left hand knows exactly what the right hands do like that. They're doing this because they're taking a hard nose attitude of that we're not gonna take any chances. They don't know what it wants to camera coming in to say, Now, wait a min, let me get this straight. You know, Unknown 28:26 the guy has proclivities to be a sexual offender, and you release them from prison. And all you did was pretty much standard proof probation supervision Have I got that correct? Unknown 28:36 You got it correct. Well why did you put him under more stringent you know his history Why did you require well because he will not be a break for a second what is it that doesn't play very well of the public so this is they know exactly what they're doing what they're doing it to make sure that they are Unknown 28:55 that they're not gonna have this blow up in their face. Okay, just just to Unknown 29:00 Just to put the screws on as many people as they possibly can, because they can. And then they had been able to do it until this guy said, No, you can't do it to me until I stop federal court structure. The way it shows on my diagram here, the Court of Appeals, it's the highest court and then they have they have appellate division of the Supreme Court. And then they have the trial level course which are consisting of Supreme Court's county courts, district courts and and New York City CMS what the NYC mean criminal court so that appears to be the structure the structure of the courts. So this decision decision here is from from looks like the Court of Appeals. Unknown 29:39 Okay, Unknown 29:42 we need Unknown 29:43 we need a new york call to come on here and help us understand all of this great organization of their courts. All right, then. Well, since we're up there in the sort of like the Northeast, let's move on up to Maine. Unknown 29:54 Do you remember roughly around October where we played a little clip of the people marching around the guys house chanting something about Unknown 30:00 We don't want you to live in a neighborhood. Oh yeah, I remember that was was that in Rhode Island, it was. Unknown 30:05 It is up there, and Rhode Island and sup in Providence. And the article is police monitoring of sex offenders home cost nearly $103,000, they had round the clock deputies guarding the guys house from people doing all kinds of, you know, vandalism, whatever they're going to do and they finally decided to shut down the detail and they ended the detail on February 15. And then on 16, some February 16 somebody through a brick through a piece of concrete through the guys window Unknown 30:36 was was a problem with that. Yeah, I mean, I guess if you were like sitting there watching TV when the concrete comes through your window that might be bad for your skull. Well, I've actually had one of those come through it. It's very discombobulating had nothing to do with registry. It was what I was a property manager. What about 30 years ago we had this mentally challenged guy and the owner had told him he would pay pay him five bucks an hour to pick Unknown 31:00 up trash and just to keep track that was an outside arrangement he had made because he was he was friends with a guy he said just let me know your hours will the owner had told him to to ask me for the money because he was not not in the office he said just go is there for the money and I didn't think about it so it comes on my door and asked me for like 25 bucks for for cleanup a doubt. I thought about it earlier about it. And he got so frustrated through through a breakthrough by window and it's very discombobulated with the project all comes through your window I can I can totally match. Yes it is. Hey guys, I do I want to take a tiny little detour just for a moment. So there's some conversation in the chat with the people that are listening in and I and I earnestly said Unknown 31:37 main but it was actually Rhode Island Can you tell me how long would it take you to drive from one side of your state to the other Unknown 31:44 was pretty pretty long drive as you're going going north to sell. That's a pretty free last Unknown 31:50 six hours, probably with five hours for sure. I know when I dropped to Las Cruces takes between three and a half to four and we're in the central part of the state. Unknown 32:00 It's a law school since the very southern part of the state. So it's you've got a ways to go before you get on the state if you're going north from here, so it would be five, six hours. And the reason why I asked you this, because I know you have a big, big state and if you were up in Maine, Rhode Island, Vermont, whatever, you could drive five hours you can make it halfway down the east coast. If you did that, those states are so tiny up there. And I'm getting I'm getting criticism for saying it was a main instead of Rhode Island. So anyway. Well, well, main is much larger than Rhode Island. Unknown 32:29 Rhode horse is tiny state I mean, you can't kick a football across it but it's it is tiny on land mass, Unknown 32:39 I think state it is it is um, you know what I think I would have liked when I was 13 years old. What would that be? I would like a hot teacher to want to do the nasty with being goober gobble with me when I was 13. Unknown 32:57 What do you think that you would have been thinking about Unknown 33:00 I'm things you were 13. I don't think I was thinking that kind of stuff where you probably not. I know actually. Because when I was 13, I had a bar mitzvah and my parents hired a belly dancer. And I was petrified. I was sitting in a chair and there's this woman shaking all over junk. I was confused I was I was scared to death. But this story is from Arizona Central, easy Central, and it says the teacher, Brittany's memoria, had six of the boy and classroom and I know that this part is not true. But it says classroom while other student watched the student wasn't watching them. The studio was keeping that look out. Unknown 33:32 But there's this 27 year old woman that's trying to hook up with the 13 year olds. What is really interesting is if you go search over on Twitter for people talking about the somebody brought up an interesting point that when they describe this, they say that the teacher the female teacher was trying to have sex with the male student. If you flip that equation around it is not going to say having sex it's going to say the male teacher was trying to rape statutory rape whatever something along those lines with the with the female students, something like that. Unknown 34:00 But this is good times Unknown 34:04 the reaction would be would be largely different with even though even though it shouldn't necessarily be different the the it's just the reality of our society when when when boys are growing up the introduction at a young age to sex is is considered has been considered a good thing and it makes a man out of them quote and Unknown 34:28 you know I can't you know in my in my life I can't remember anybody ever saying that an older guy introducing a teenage girl to sex has ever made a woman out of right absolutely absolutely right this is one of those biases that we just live with. It's one of those things about clothing and won't be can go into the store and buy anything that sold and put it on another thing happen. No comments will be made to speak out you had a manga when the woman's department start buying things and putting them on find out what happens explain that one too. Unknown 35:00 Why is why is that the high standard I don't know yet I mean we talked about we this comes up big time and during the presidential debate of what does the woman were versus like the guys wearing a red or blue tie no one gives a shit with the guys wearing but if the woman is wearing to read or two white or hair is not right or makeup not right it is ridiculously a double standard absolutely got it as go to the go to our next is that there's a double standard when it comes to reporting we had a long time General Manager of K 87 retire and the last few months and she at one time was reported on air talent before she was in management but she said when she was in her young days that would people would call the station and she wanted to talk about news when they're when they would always tell her something about how she could make yourself look better on the air and I went how often does a male anchor get that kind of phone call wall and held one more talk to you today about is that tie if you have just a little bit wider tie and if you have had it you had a little bit tight around your neck you'd like to hold up I mean Unknown 36:00 nobody would ever tell them I'm a link or is that kind of question correct correct and make that kind of comment but barely and said well I sure would like for someone to call and ask me about details Unknown 36:10 yeah right Her name was Mary Mary and Roper but Unknown 36:14 we have we have those double standards of life but what I find so unfortunate about this story I mean the the punishment is going to be way disproportionate to the crime Unknown 36:26 this I mean she's being held essential without bond they've got a quarter right and dollar bond and a 27 year old as a teaching eight is probably not gonna be able to make that which means she's going to be forced to sit in jail, which means she's going to be forced to plead out which means with the high profile nature this case the courts are going to be under a lot of pressure with Arizona's this tough state to begin with, but they're going to be under a lot of pressure would be harder than it sounds like the dad on the boys side is really driving at both parents. But it sounds like the dad is pretty irritated about it. And Unknown 36:59 I think that Unknown 37:00 Harsh sentence in prison but it's over the top but I'd be saying the same thing if it was the other way around that would be saying the exact same thing I think that that this Unknown 37:10 where it was consensual you don't want 13 year olds consenting to have sex well I'm not saying that's okay but we don't also want to wrote a people a person's life for eternity because of that mistake and lapse in judgment we would hope that she could make better decisions going forward and and not and not Unknown 37:29 succumb to that to that temptation Unknown 37:33 well very good so she's pretty much going to go away for a while I would imagine she's gonna have the book granted or as the expression goes right it's gonna be hard knowing how tough they were in Arizona to not imagine her going to prison sounds like there's just too much overpowering evidence terms of yeah oh yeah there's certainly is that the electronic chats and the probably have a confession she would have had no reason not to confess because the law enforcement What to tell. Unknown 38:00 They were there to help and we just need to get this all straightened out and make sure it's getting straightened out all right but I would expect that she's given a confession suppression of the confessions going to be very difficult she's Oh educated person Oh, let me throw this at you to then do you think to go back to the double standard thing do you think that they're going to treat him as the quote unquote victim and he's going to need treatment and all this stuff or I feel that it wouldn't like if it were girl that there would be all kinds of she will she needs treatment and therapy she's gonna be scarred and all this stuff and PTSD but I have a feeling that the boy will not get that same kind of conversations. I suspect they will in this day and age I suspect it will get Unknown 38:43 they'll play that up. In fact, I think the parents 45 lawsuit Unknown 38:48 sitting down what are they going to get? They can't get anything out of the girl. The woman can now the school system, though Unknown 38:54 she's in school was negligent not properly supervising. Unknown 39:00 grading course it's hard to screen for people when they haven't done anything, right. So, but they had a look out to, you know, Unknown 39:09 it's hard to you know, I I'd like to consider myself to be fairly thorough and employment interviews but it's hard to imagine First of all, I can't imagine I would be a principal of a school. But if I were an administrator of a school that's hard for me to imagine how comfortable be having that conversation because when you get hard people to work in high school and middle school what we used to call Junior how settings you got well developed the physical attributes on these young young people. And so I would, I would find it uncomfortable but how are you going to have a conversation like that now I just want to make sure I know right fan Yeah, you understand that? That you're going to find somebody who's youngsters very attractive? What is your reaction going to be one of them starts flirting with you. I mean, what do you got a 15 year old it starts I mean, how do you handle that? I just don't know how you're supposed to anticipate this stuff. I don't know how you would adequately supervised Unknown 40:00 It doesn't prevent it. But would be to have a camera monitoring everything that goes on in every square inch of the school building, which you wouldn't have enough people to monitor that would you know, definitely not. Unknown 40:14 All right. Well, the young lady's life is ruined, and all likely, definitely that definitely. Um, and since I erroneously mentioned main before, I am going to talk about main now. So if you are a sex offender, and you want to live in a multi unit building, like a duplex or a quad Plex, and you have a child living like across the hall, you are probably up the creek and not gonna be able to live there. This is actually from MSN. com. But it says the law would ban sex offenders from some multi unit buildings houses in Maine. Wow, that's not cool, man. It's a really short article. So there's not a whole lot that we can dig into. It looks like that. It's also if they come through the same door. Now what I'm trying to visualize because I lived in Grand Rapids at one time, we talked about a couple podcasts back and I lived in I lived in a home that had Unknown 41:00 It was such a large all home, they had divided into multi units. And at this point in my life, don't remember if it was five or six units, but we all had our own unit. But we came into the same common front door. And this looks like it has that common front door interests. But what constitutes the interests? I mean, is it a door that leads you into the house where you start going to your own? Unknown 41:21 To me, I was very confused about this. I can imagine that you have like an interior kind of duplex or four Plex where you have a common hallway to an interior door of your apartment not and I don't know the right terms for this but my the door of my apartment leads right to the parking lot where my car is. But there are some apartments up the street where you go in a main door and then maybe have some stairs to go upstairs and the apartments are on the interior side you have a full year I guess would be a word to use. Unknown 41:47 Well, I can imagine that scenario where the now now you can't live there because there's a kid that lives in the Holocaust street Unknown 41:53 it says across across the hall from and convicted convicted sex run from living in a multi unit that shares an entrance. Unknown 42:00 With a unit occupied by a minor, so I'm visualizing that five unit house I lived lived in, there's a minor living and one of the five units Unknown 42:10 and Unknown 42:12 it shares the multi unit building that shares an interest whether you to occupy so we all came down the same front door to get to our units. So it was seemed like this would qualify. And if main is anything like Grand Rapids there was a lot of big old houses in Grand Rapids I had been subdivided sure we're living in it so and I like always bring this up about a mutual friend that doesn't think that we need to do anything in the legislature. But this seems like exactly where we should be like, Whoa, this is dumb. Here's the reasons why this is dumb to keep it from actually ending up becoming any kind of lon de railing up before it gets there. That is my belief and I'm busy doing as much of that as I can right now and the way that I can to just Unknown 43:00 Stop that. But some believe that you just hope that they magically figure this out. And they don't magically figure it out. Because there's too many issues. there too many issues that they deal with it Unknown 43:10 the law enforcement apparatus and tell them this is a good thing. And if they're not hearing from anybody else have been just got to get rubber stamped. Yeah, we just lose by default. Unknown 43:20 Well, to continue on with a I guess sort of like a similar trend in New York since the dems have taken over the house on that side of things that they have extended out the statute of limitations to like pretty much forever practically. And now, all kinds of people that had already passed some level of some some portion of statute limitations. They are like, like attorney shopping so they can bring their case and try and either Sue civilly or criminally, because they have like a whole bunch of extra time, I don't know what it was. But if you're the new statutory civil claims in those cases, until the victim is 55 years old, you can be 12 Unknown 44:00 And now you've got like 40 years to figure out how to how to go get granddad for messing with you. And then criminal charges are allowed until criminal charges are now allowed until the victim is 28 years old Unknown 44:13 well I'm not as troubled I'm troubled but I'm not as troubled about the criminal side cuz cuz 28 is still relatively young I would prefer that they have not done that but that's the trend across the country and that's an example of where Unknown 44:33 my democratic friends on one of the issues that I feel strongly about I have difficulty was a lot of them the republicans have we just had a vote here on a Senate bill that would do raise the age on the criminal side to 35 and we got Unknown 44:53 eight Republican senators to vote against it and only seven democratic senators to vote against it now that's that's Unknown 45:00 That's 15. But only problem is 15 was not enough and it passed senate because we didn't we didn't get the requisite opposition. Unknown 45:10 This this is this is a this is a trend that that I don't see shopping or the the Unknown 45:17 the the advocates kind of man and say that that the memories are the first of all the minors under the control of the adult which is hard to argue that point with them. So you've got 11 year old at certain kinds of controls of the adult so therefore you cut them some slack for not reporting when they reach 1819, then they're no longer under control what's the right amount of time to give them right on the criminal side, but because there again, you're trying to put a person in a cage for a long time and the more time you give them, the less fair it's going to be to the person who's accused because it becomes more difficult for them to simulate any evidence that would have been beneficial to them if you were to take the statue Liberty Unknown 46:00 All fall together where they could charge something Unknown 46:04 it any point that you've got potentially decades and decades would pass on the civil side when you take it up to 55. that's troubling as well, because the evidentiary standard in a civil proceeding is not as strong that to prevail in a civil action, you only need a preponderance of the evidence. So you have you have the case like OJ Simpson, where they were there for the criminal court acquitted and found him not guilty. And as a civil court found him liable for the death of Ron Goldman and Nicole Brown Simpson and so you could end up with someone I made. I know I'm not supposed to question anybody's intention. But you could end up with something that's totally monetarily motivated, that makes the accusation and I know that we're flood mortals and people do make false accusations I think we just talked about on last week's podcast didn't wait. We talked about last week the podcast before that we talked about the smallest thing that turned out to be Unknown 47:00 Yes. And it appears to have been economically driven. Well, Unknown 47:08 I hate to tell you folks when when you open that door, anybody, including you, people who think you're for it, right? You're going to end up being within the zone of this happening. There's, there's no there's you can say, Well, I know I didn't do anything like that. That doesn't mean you can't be accused. Unknown 47:27 I would never do anything like that though. That's fine. But that doesn't can't accuse you of having done something. Unknown 47:35 And I was just playing devil's advocate for a second I mean, sure, Unknown 47:40 picture the picture picture someone for whatever their motivations are making an accusation against you and trying to take your for everything and you've got a very low evidentiary standard in a civil case of just slightly more than 50% Unknown 47:54 and that that's that's quite quite scary to me. Unknown 47:57 I do want to take an opportunity I do. Unknown 48:00 struggle with this particular thing of trying to be compassionate to a victim of an alleged crime. But if you go back and listen to if anybody doesn't know, I just listened to a mountain of podcasts. But there's a one that probably my favorite one is called the skeptics guide to the universe. And they did a really long segment about memory in last week's episode, that I think it would be really good for people to go listen to, I can't I don't have the time code of it, but it's fairly early in it. And it is just how flawed our memory system is. It is not like you put a VCR a cassette into the thing and you press record and it records what ever is in its purview you are constantly constantly manipulating what you what got recorded you are you know you're in your know your your some 50 years older than me and you know, we're both males but a female like everything that you are about everything that is your human being. Unknown 49:00 Self, you envision the world differently. So now you're recording the thing in a flood sense. If you're short, people just looked all if you're tall people look short, your perception is just warped. And without corroborating evidence, it's just really freaking hard to do anything with someone's memory and a reliable sense to go, Well, 14 years ago, what happened? Unknown 49:21 Well, you've touched that memory so many times throughout your life, you very possibly do not remember what you think you remembered. And I just, I just want to like make that statement, that assertion that it's just it's really hard, but it's something you have to keep in mind that people do not remember what they think they remember Unknown 49:40 we would be hard pressed to remember everything we say on this podcast once we get off I know when I when I recount a conversation, so but I don't tell you exactly what I said. Because I don't know what exactly said I'll reconstruct the conversation. Unknown 49:55 Try trying to do the best I can, but you don't remember what you said. It is the time Unknown 50:00 goes by the way, I screwed this up with myself as I just tell people that you do believe in fundamental fairness, and you would want to parse accused of crime. Let's say you were accused of a crime, you would want the system to be able to treat you fairly. You wouldn't want the system to presume anything about you just put yourself on the accused side. And since I know you're fair person, you would want to be treated fairly. We can't give this person a fair trial. 34 years after this allegation. We can't. It's tragic. We're sorry, but there's no way we can we can give them a fair trial. Unknown 50:37 Now, if they want to committed admit it if you want to cover up the hamster hamster admitted. He goes beyond the statute limitation for those who don't know the name Hastert former speaker the United States House Dennis Hastert from Illinois he admitted when he was being sent us for his federal crime of structure and transactions and giving a false statement he was he was paying hush money. Unknown 51:00 One of his victims, he admitted it, sentencing he did those things. But if the person doesn't admit it, I would want to even treat Hastert fair, even though I didn't take too much of his politics, he deserved heaven. Roy Moore everybody deserves fairness. And I just tried to appeal to people's fair enough that you would want fairness, you would want to be treated fairly help. You won't have anybody disagree when you ask them first, you would like to be treated fairly. If somebody do something right. And they'll say, but will say, then pull it but they'll they'll pull it back and say, Well, I would never do anything like that. So that's exactly that's not but but but yeah, but that doesn't make the argument Go ahead. But you've got them to bet by into the date what would it be treated fair? If someone if someone were to make a false accusation against you? Would you want us to believe it out the gate without anything to corroborate? Or would you want us to treat you fairly and we give you the benefit of the doubt which the constitution required, they would say absolutely, yes. And they would say Okay, now we're flipping the scales. Now you're making that like a Unknown 52:00 You do want this person to be treated fairly W and it's hard for them to backtrack from that because they have said that they believe in fundamental fairness. Unknown 52:13 We can't give the person a fair trial decades later. Unknown 52:17 Right. Unknown 52:19 There was an interesting decision that came out of SCOTUS this past week and you can find it over at SCOTUS blog the URLs just way too long for me to even try and say anything but it's it's an argument analysis court poised to rule for challenger in dispute over constitutionality of sex offender law This is a it's a it's an excellent read and the way that the justices were asking questions it just Unknown 52:42 it feels like it's good thing going on. Well, why did you say that a decision came out I didn't know a decision has come out Unknown 52:49 that this this isn't a decision Unknown 52:53 Well, not arguments are not a decision now. They're not Unknown 52:57 okay. This Unknown 52:59 isn't Unknown 53:00 Court poised to rule But have they ruled yet? Okay. I guess I'm confused on on terminology. So this is just them asking questions. And I guess it's called oral arguments. It was a hell of an argument that they they did I heard oral arguments in a case that are going to rule by June. Unknown 53:21 Okay. All right. So we only have a few months, but it seems like it's in our favor because of the way that they're asking questions, including like our favorite Neil Gorsuch and Kevin Oh, Unknown 53:32 well, I would tell I would caution people that when you listen to oral arguments, you should not conclude anything from that Unknown 53:43 it can be very misleading. You listen to oral arguments, because those arguments are designed to to get to get the parties to reveal something and make a mistake of blunder and to get concessions out of them. But it doesn't necessarily mean Unknown 54:00 That that's the way that the justice is leaning Unknown 54:04 court watch your show the years have been sorely disappointed by by pronouncing how they think the courts going to rule based on all arguments I therefore will care act it was supposed to be declared unconstitutional based on all arguments and it wasn't all right Unknown 54:20 yeah I could I could I could I could go on and on with people the the civil commitment of sex sexual offenders the recent case of the name is escaping me in the last month I recently last five or six years and recently there was there was a there was a case where were they there was a lot of skepticism from justice scalia but he voted up hold civil commit so you just would you would you concentrate on oral argument it's fine to look at and listen to it I read the transcripts but don't try to predict what this course is going to do reading supreme court because there will argue about suggest that Unknown 54:58 is there do you want to thank Unknown 55:00 Some of the details of what is going on in this case, though, because I don't think we've covered this at any point in the past, Unknown 55:07 I have not read the brief so I can only I can only cover a little bit of it. And it has to it has to do with supervised release on the federal system in the federal system and and what what you have in the federal system since the reagan reforms of 1984, the criminal criminal justice the report back to 1984, we did some major changes in our federal system in 1984, both to bail and to the sentence called the sentencing reform act of 1984 and the bail Reform Act of 1984 and and they abolished what we what we had in the way of good time and what we had and way of parole in the federal system. And it's been so long since we've had that at all. Remember what portion of a federal census you had to serve before you eligible for parole. It was some small portion less than a half and you had you were eligible to be Unknown 56:00 Consider for parole and they abolish that. And they put in these two sentences that we have now of the sentencing guidelines where you get a range of sentencing options based on all these formula, formulaic Unknown 56:15 grid that they have. And it is crazy, I hear about it often on another podcast, it seems very complicated. And then and then following that you have a period of supervised release, which took the place of of parole and supervised release is not exactly probation because Congress wanted it to be your the helping hand part that you need when you come out of prison. But a helping hand also can involve conditions that you need to follow. What are supervised release gets tricky is where they impose conditions that you violate. So I think a period of 10 years supervised release that you violate what that 10 years may take you beyond what the original jurisdiction was for your crime. Unknown 57:00 Volleyed supervised release that the judge piles on additional five years What? It gets very problematic, because at the facts that that will revoke your supervisor release or not decided by jury, and the evidentiary standard for that is much lower. It's like a probation revocation the the the rules of evidence are are more relaxed in terms of what admissible and and the standard is not beyond a reasonable doubt that a jury or judge and at the end the guilt or innocence face would have to have to decide. So the Supreme Court is expressing dismay about putting a personal back in prison for years for Valley title chronic conditions on a much lower evidentiary standard and that's that's what the crux of this is as well why would why would Why would we allow our judges to put people back into prison for years beyond what they would have been able to been sentenced to had had they been sent us for the crime originally and and and the judge the judge doesn't have to find Unknown 58:00 Guilt find the violation beyond a reasonable doubt just by preponderance of the evidence. It feel like I think where I am, if you let me know, you met, you do some violation, like one day before you come off and the judge says, Okay, well, I'm going to revoke the rest of your probation, and you have to go back. So you're going to do one more day in prison. It this, Unknown 58:20 this feels way, way out of whack with that. I mean, that's my understanding of how it works in this state. So, and I know feds are different, but it just feels like hey, you've got one week left, you've done this violation. Oh, here's another 10 years like for what you Hey, you missed curfew. Like what? Unknown 58:38 Oh, well, this this if you're going by the SCOTUS blog and I'm only going by the SCOTUS blog, this is not my opinion, but it but the people here seem to think two to three really conservative justices. So what's your Alito Thomas and who's the other one that's concerned Unknown 58:57 are squarely on the side of the government. Unknown 59:00 They could do that. Unknown 59:02 But But even even some of the more or less conservative judges like like Roberts and Gorsuch seem to have real problems with a degree and even even capital expressed alarm so so it looks like if they've got it right here is that this has got to be very problematic for the government it may jeopardize that will supervised release system Unknown 59:25 interesting Do you think that that would filter down to any of our people Unknown 59:30 I don't see how it could okay yeah that's good people that have sexual offences in the federal system they're a heck of a lot of them it's a significant portion I don't know if it's 20% way somewhere in that 20% range but a significant number of the Federal offenders are for for downloading possession distribution of porn interstate solicitation travel interstate lines to beat a minor of course are always fake minors you got to meet but but there's a lot of there's a good Unknown 1:00:04 I just don't understand how you can be 5060 7080 Unknown 1:00:08 years old and actually believe that a 1516 year old is want to have sex with you Unknown 1:00:16 I it just I mean have you forgotten when you were 16 did you take a 60 year old was hot Unknown 1:00:23 somehow they think you think that they actually going to think you're hot Unknown 1:00:30 just in the chat someone said the P o said that if you violate your probation starts over that doesn't sound at all right but i mean it could be true but that just sounds horrible. La well it would be depending on the state i don't think that person's talk about federal because nobody her she is federal probation. Unknown 1:00:48 The federal system the probation is almost almost unheard on supervised release was not the same thing as probation ready to be a part of registry matters get links at registry matters dot Unknown 1:01:00 CEO. If you need to be discreet about it, contact them by email registry matters cast at gmail. com You can call or text or ransom message to 747 to 274477 Unknown 1:01:17 want to support registry matters on a monthly basis, head to patreon. com slash registry matters. Not ready to become a patron. Give a five star review at Apple podcasts or Stitcher or tell your buddies that your treatment class about the podcast we want to send out a big heartfelt support for those on the registry. Keep fighting without you, we can't succeed you make it possible. And here we go from reason magazine talking about sex trafficking, but it apparently is the authorities are walking back big claims about an international human trafficking ring involving patriots on a Robert Kraft Unknown 1:01:57 Ah, it's like we're further and further Unknown 1:02:00 They're trying to criminalize just anything sexual because make maybe it makes us feel good that people are having pleasure I guess but this is a about massage parlor in Florida and like their allegations that the women are are like in bondage and they can't leave but when you actually dig in and start reading anything about it there's like they could go out on the street and ask for help if they really wanted to. But they didn't. Unknown 1:02:29 I don't know this. This probably goes along with the fastest sista stuff where they shut down personals on Craigslist and all this like we're just making more and more stuff illegal for something that doesn't even really exist. The not to minimize people that are actually trafficked and are actually victims of this but I don't think that this is the right place. Unknown 1:02:48 Well, Unknown 1:02:49 I feel similarly I think that human trafficking is a horrible thing. Just like I feel right that's a horrible thing and condemn it. Unknown 1:03:00 Both of the strongest of language possible. But I feel like when we describe rate in a way that that that means that by calling things rapists not the same thing with human trafficking people were actually human traffic. That's not an imaginary thing. It does happen. People in poor countries and even to some degree in this country, it happens. People that are exploited when they are young, and they run away to get rich in the movie star industry. And they find out the door right to really take that have to sell their body, they end up getting traffic, but that's don't demean those people who were who were victims of Unknown 1:03:35 of a real crime, a real horrible crime and expand the definition of human trafficking so much to include things that people are doing because they choose to do it. I would venture to say I'm guessing but I suspect these women were choosing to be there. Unknown 1:03:54 I don't think they were brought in bondage and they were held against their will to do that. Unknown 1:04:00 Is that an ideal optimal setting for a person to sell sex probably not but guess what has been going on for a long time I'm not profession as I recall right yeah that's what I've heard all my life Unknown 1:04:14 I just don't understand how how that we we we diminish the serious crimes by calling something I've even heard the definition of human trafficking should include people who who are in college at sell their pictures to pay that really are you are you big human traffic if you go to an agent that says I can get you whatever thousand dollars for for for for a photo said it is that human trafficking is that exploitation you're getting something in return you could go down to the local Denny's and white tables and get get yourself 10. $15 an hour doing that if you wanted to go so plasma you could do that as well. Unknown 1:04:57 But if you if you were blessed with attributes that people Unknown 1:05:00 Want to pay to look at it you want to voluntarily sell those I just don't have a problem but I know the people on the religious right the real conservative religious people would say well or not though that calls God made that for enjoyment between man and wife and I understand that I've heard that a long time but I don't want to be the morality police for people who want to do things that have a voluntary nature and i'm not i'm not really sure what went on in this thing with the with the NFL owner, but I just suspect there's a lot of sensationalism and a lot of overflowing because they try once they spend a bunch of money on running these things. They can't just say, well, we ran into staying for last six months. didn't really find a whole lot going on here. We spent $270,000 of manpower and well, we found out a couple of people that have standing in the community are going and hard hookers, but really the whole lot going on here. I mean, that just isn't the way it goes. Unknown 1:06:00 That's not the way you justify you have to either have to overflow what they find these operations. Unknown 1:06:07 Mm hmm. Well, this next thing comes from the federal register.gov. And this, there's nothing for us to do with this one other than go, Hmm, if you're a tier three offender, and you are a veteran, you can forget having your courtesy. I don't know what the right word is a courtesy burial. So you're, you're gonna have to do it on the economy. And you don't get that as a VA benefit, I guess we could say. So that's really awesome. I think it applies to being buried in a national cemetery, aren't you? Correct? Yes, yes. Yes. Thank you. So you you forfeit that Unknown 1:06:39 that think it would be an earned thing that you would go with one of the many benefits that you were that you're in from the service. But, you know, seems like to me that the logical thing doesn't stop there. Why not? Yeah, we shouldn't. We shouldn't have these people going to be hospitals and clinics for treatment. Or VA loans. Yeah. Or GI Bill. Just forfeit. Unknown 1:07:00 Everything, Unknown 1:07:01 they've already done some damage in terms of accessibility to loans. Unknown 1:07:07 But but this is this is totally kooky as far as I'm concerned, Unknown 1:07:12 if you could make a rational argument, Unknown 1:07:15 and that's the big if you could, if you could make a rational argument, which I don't believe that I could have ever heard one, but if you said, Well, we need to keep them out of the hospitals, because there might be grandchildren there. If you could put forth that rational argument. I'm waiting to hear the rational argument for a person who's in a cemetery arrested. Unknown 1:07:35 Yes. Well, you've you've guard the conscience of the United States. Unknown 1:07:42 Well, Unknown 1:07:43 you're, you're resting, so I don't, I don't know how the test would do anything to score it. But it to me is not as funny as an argument is about the same sex marriage. They say, well, it destroys the institution of marriage. Really, I don't understand how you cannot be happily married and be committed to your spouse. Unknown 1:08:00 I don't know how somebody else is doing. I don't understand how a person who served the country and goes to the final resting spot. I don't know how that does anything to anybody. I'm at a loss to figure out how it does anything. Unknown 1:08:16 Yeah. Other than to just a shame you some more. Unknown 1:08:20 I mean I don't think a single person has worn the uniform hasn't made a mistake and broken laws in their life. Unknown 1:08:28 All right well so I said I didn't want to cover it long. here's here's something. Here's some fun at Iowa that there's a guy who got convicted of a sexual fence. And like, I have very minor problems with this one. Like it's very recent, but a registered sex offender allowed in Boone schools. This guy is like, Hey, I would like to be involved in my kids education and maybe go to some school functions, basketball games, concerts, whatever these things are. And to me it feels rational that he had talked to the school superintendent or principal or whatever and get Unknown 1:09:00 permission to go and he has to be there no earlier than 15 minutes before the thing. So hey, get in there, get your popcorn. Go get your seat. And then when the presentation is over, you have to be gone within 15 minutes, grab your coat, say hi to your kid and like out the door. It doesn't sound unreasonable to me. But of course, the parents are like, well, we you know, he's already proven that he can't be trusted around kids. So we when we go to these events, I'm going to have to make sure that I stick closer to my child have mom said like really like you think that just because this guy is present that he's going to like lose a key on your kid or something Unknown 1:09:40 alive. I'm struggling with this one. I have to admire the school district and bowed because they said they have no intention of changing their policy. And of course that could mean that they don't serve on the school board beyond the next election because school boards are generally like I liked it, but Unknown 1:09:56 I don't recall anybody ever showed me Unknown 1:10:00 any evidence of it a school function that our parent or guardian being a part of that outing, be at a field trip or anything to do with a school function be at a sporting event. I just don't remember anybody Unknown 1:10:16 validating any sexual impropriety bonds of parrot. I've not heard of that. I mean, Unknown 1:10:24 I mean, I go back to the Lincoln administration, how far do you go by Unknown 1:10:31 I can't I like in all of this stuff. Same thing with Halloween, like the kids are under heavy supervision, not even necessarily supervision. They're generally in crowds, like, hey, they're hanging out with their buddies. It's like, it's probably not going to happen in a group setting of any sort. I don't think someone's going to act out and be like, hey, there's 100 people around here. And that chick looks kind of hot. Let me go try and see if I like, Hey, kid, you want to double your lunch money? It's just not gonna happen. That way. I don't. Unknown 1:11:00 Think well, I've not heard of it the it's it's it's bizarre. It's but you have to cut the lady a little bit of slack that was an interview about Unknown 1:11:11 if you've been told for last 20 years about how dangerous that these people are i mean it's it's kind of a natural reaction that that she has because that's what she's heard on the news for so long right Unknown 1:11:26 yeah Unknown 1:11:30 all right I totally need you to cover this one this is from courthouse news and Supreme Court expands precedent on ineffective counsel. I understand what ineffective Council is, but I don't understand how this plays out. And I kind of don't understand how it applies to us so please explain to me Unknown 1:11:50 well I don't understand what you don't understand about it but it's a bunch of words and I understand the words but how that all fits into I mean, an effective councils like your attorney didn't Unknown 1:12:00 present you as well as they could. Well, it's a 35 page opinion, do you think we can link to it in some way? It's probably going to be overly complicated, something we can talk about repeatedly. But it's a new area of law that's open the door because the Supreme Court has decided that they're going to crack the door a little bit more for ineffective assistance Council. There's a it's a very tough standard when you're trying to undo a conviction since the majority of cases are resolved by plea is very difficult to to to to prevail or ineffective assistance of counsel and n Unknown 1:12:39 dot five years ago, which is not that long. There was a couple of cases that came down or were a plea offer had not been communicated to defend it. And the court said that that was ineffective assistance and and this this deals with a person who, who who had a plea Unknown 1:13:00 That that waved his right to appeal. And usually those rights to appeal don't exclude every type of appeal that you could imagine. But they you may be excluded from appealing your sentence you may be excluded from for appealing the Unknown 1:13:19 sub some aspect of the evidence collection process or or or or how they interpret in the statute to apply to you that you got for county or whatever, but they did this this this play included a waiver of his appeal. But then the guy decided he wanted to appeal and his attorney refused to file a notice of the appeal because he said that he couldn't do it because it violated the plea agreement he had no right to appeal so what the what the Supreme Court held in this case was that that the Unknown 1:13:55 the notice of appeal should have been filed to preserve his right so that in a Unknown 1:14:00 itself was was ineffective assistance and not following the notice of the appeal and so the government argued against it but he got he got some favorable decision from the Supreme Court so to bar deliver the opinion of the court and which robbers joined and liberals crowd always joins on stuff like this so it was able so to Meijer Ginsburg, Briar Kagan and Roberts who who who made it by the opinion but those who have pled out Unknown 1:14:32 for any type of offence are going to have one more mechanism available to them if they fit within this narrow window here of of this decision to go back and attack on an ineffective assistance which which is a tough standard of meat but you got another thing that opened up to you now Unknown 1:14:52 All right. And then also Kevin on must have voted because it was just corsets, Alito and Thomas were the ones that dissented so that means kept Unknown 1:15:00 was on the side of supporting this I think he joined a part part of it okay it says courses showing and which Alito joined parts to one into so so yeah it's a pretty pretty pretty good decision but like say probably need to spend a little more time on it as we go along without frequently come back to things and I'll have to talk to a practitioners and see how they feel about it and how they can actually develop their appellate practice around this decision and see if it's if it's going to be something that's that's going to be meaningful if it's going to apply just a very very very small number of people Unknown 1:15:38 all right, then, you know, this would be the time that I wish I had the the the cops theme song where we're like, Bad boys, bad boys, what you're going to do this one, this article comes out of assault and routine compliance checks or anything, but here it is on some Tuesday night, Thursday night or something. You're sitting at home, you're in your underwear, sit on your lazy butt with the chair and l for loser and your kickback. Unknown 1:16:00 There's a knock at the door and you open it up. And there's eight officers and a camera crew to just check on you and make sure that you're doing what you're supposed to do. This is this is definitely like, how much does this frickin cost? This is out of Oklahoma. And why do we need to put this much force out and play to go make sure that you're 1000 feet away that you don't have decorations out? You don't have whatever, I don't know. But why do you need eight officers to do this? Unknown 1:16:33 It's it's because there's a pot of money available that do it. There's compliance checks have been provided by the feds since the passage of the Adam Walsh Act Unknown 1:16:44 and 2006 and it's it's a big, big business but it's one of the reasons why I want to continue to argue that it's a civil regulatory scheme and right with a civil regulatory scheme. You don't have guns. Unknown 1:17:00 tanks and armored personnel carriers and you don't do you don't approach people in such a fashion and civil regulatory scheme so again I try to buy into what they say you say it so said right right right right right right okay well this is several regulatory scheme let's get let's take it out of the hands of law enforcement because simply regulated people do not have to face guns and tanks at their door and I'm exaggerating but the tank but I'm not exaggerating much because these people show up in the the garb the full garb sometimes where you think that you've got a SWAT raid about to go down Unknown 1:17:36 and they'll have their hands on their weapons is if you're going to fire them and it's very discombobulating to the family members to the neighbors who see that going down Can you imagine what your neighbor things when you've got six right armed officers with their with their hands on the trigger Unknown 1:17:53 and bag and at someone's door carrying on like that. Can you imagine what how that would how they would make the neighbors feel about that. Unknown 1:18:00 particular home but what about your family and your wife your Unknown 1:18:06 kids was a door can you imagine Can you imagine the kid just like stands there what's themselves and there's a puddle of P because the cop standing there with a gun drawn right and the kids face so yes I can imagine it and it's a it's a tragedy I wish I had an answer for it litigation as one answer which there's not enough of litigation challenging their authority to do this and they're going to fight back and say they have the authority under the community caretaker doctor and they're going to say that that that they are charged with tracking and keeping watch on these terrible group of people and that this is a part of their community target caretaking responsibilities and it's going to be up to the offenders to document this by camera by photographic evidence by witness statements about how excessive it is, and we're going to have to have some test decisions on term term terms of how far they can go with these. Unknown 1:19:00 Call compliance checks with the best way to heads of compliance checks just take it out of the hands the law enforcement Unknown 1:19:06 I totally like your idea i and i don't know which martial arts I used to sort of know but they're in certain martial arts or even like wrestling whatever use their weight against them and I to me that's what you're describing is that hey if this is a civil regulatory scheme Why are you guys come in and all the tactical gear so use their argument against the locals like pull them in to then flip them over so that they end up on the defensive end of trying to defend well if it's civil regulatory scheme that they shouldn't be out there and tactical gear and and SWAT trucks and whatnot like the DMV people don't drive around this way that's a civil regulatory scheme so why do you need these people out and all this kind of kind of absolute just you know my god you have you have to join them into arguments so that's what I try to do I try to I try to call out their arguments and use it against them and and it's civil regulatory quit fighting it agree with them and let's let's turn let's build a civil regulatory scheme. Unknown 1:19:57 All right then, and Unknown 1:20:00 This one start like this one made a bunch of news. This one ends up coming out of Snopes is as the title of it, as did California democrats introduce an LGBT q bill to protect pedophiles who rape children. Unknown 1:20:14 And unfortunately, the answer is only mostly false because it's only like for the most terrible of the people that it would extend to. But so this started just making rounds. And I picked up on it because I was like, wait a minute, this is garbage. And it turns out to like, pretty much be all false. But that's not what this thing is saying. But you know, and I have a link to the source article to see where it was originally reported. And it's just it's just bizarre that people would take something and just grab a couple of buzzwords and then report on it in such a way that makes you think that the democrats in California it's really bizarre but fear mongering it is. Yes, they're just they're there. They're trying to apply the same excuse. Unknown 1:21:00 Excuse relief from registration say excuse but the same register relief that I think is currently available to those who have same sex because right now it appears to be polite to handle activity five got it right did you read it the same and yeah pretty much and so what snip says is what's false is that it says the bill would not shield anybody from the requirement to register as a sex offender rather would leave that decision in eligible cases to the decision of the presiding judge okay so you know if there's a certain condition where it does apply them the judge can say yay or nay but it's not like it makes it all of them within 10 years of the of the of the miners age and it has to be consensual and then they but it just removes it did only be for heterosexuals way I understand it and feel free to California to correct us if we're wrong but that was what I understood from from my quick read Unknown 1:21:53 and um, yeah and I didn't want to dig into that one for a long because we're running long as it is and we want to cover like the the feature thing which is Unknown 1:22:00 The Third Circuit decision is that right from the United States Court of Appeals for the third circuit which states is that right off the bat that would be Rhode Island Unknown 1:22:14 those people Unknown 1:22:17 it's a bunch of bunch of darn liberal do gutters and and yeah that's all like the blue states up there you go west coast blue you got northeast coast all blue alright so little do gooders and what are they talking about Island is actually pretty conservative from what people are telling us up there. But it's a it's only three states I think Rhode Island, New Jersey and Pennsylvania and I think Guam or the Virgin Islands or some something Unknown 1:22:44 What did the what was the decision about Unknown 1:22:48 this this decision is potentially Unknown 1:22:52 potentially significant, it definitely this significant and Third Circuit already but let's let's make sure I've got those Third Circuit states Right, right. Unknown 1:23:00 Take a look at the at the map of the circuit said I want people to Unknown 1:23:04 to get excited and think they're within the zone of the Third Circuit and then it turns out or not. So we we've got it. We've got to get this right. So the circuit court system is Unknown 1:23:18 I should have a hot link to this by now the third circuit is Delaware, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, the Virgin Islands and Hmm, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, you said Delaware? New Jersey, Pennsylvania and the Virgin Islands? Unknown 1:23:35 Delaware, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Virginia, not Rhode Island. So that's why I wanted to double check it. So Rhode Island, right, right. Right. But Virgin Islands is like 2000 miles away. That doesn't mean Unknown 1:23:46 somewhere so they Unknown 1:23:50 they so that's that that's that's where they put them. So it's one of our smaller circuit courts of appeals. There's a Third Circuit third fourth. Unknown 1:24:01 Judges seeded the first circuit is the smallest with all my six judges seated then you can go to the Ninth Circuit, which is the largest and territory in population. There's 29 judges. So the third the Third Circuit is one of the smaller ones, but not the smallest. Unknown 1:24:16 Okay. So that the what what the case is about as a as a process called habeas corpus, Unknown 1:24:24 and habeas corpus is kind of when you're getting to the end of what you can do to challenge your conviction, hey, biases as as, as one of the final remedies that people people look look towards, if they've done their direct appeal. If they had the right to a direct appeal, and they've done their post conviction of relief processes in their states that you have you have the opportunity to take your claims into federal district court if you're racing federal constitution claims and you could add so you you're looking at a Third Circuit Court of Appeals, which is the second highest tribunal in the country. Unknown 1:25:00 There's there there there 12 Circuit Court of Appeals. There's 11 named numbered circuits. And then there's the DC circuit. So this is this was one of 11 Circuit Court of Appeals around the country. And that a DC circuit is really a full circuit, but it's called the DC circuit. It doesn't have a number. Unknown 1:25:20 All right. Um, and you often talk about, we talk about these different things, but hey, this is just a vehicle to get a thing into court, correct? Yes, an old anxious, anxious rid of basically bring me the person to bring me the individual and so it's it's evolved through time Unknown 1:25:44 when you go back to Unknown 1:25:47 ancient times, we didn't have probation parole systems, we didn't have the form of community control now. So the person was was was was in a custodial setting and physical custody, but as time has evolved, Hey, be us. Unknown 1:26:00 has been recognized to to extend beyond the actual physical custody. So in order to bring a federal Hey, be a slave, now we're only talking about federal This is a federal hey this claim you also have state abs, they may have more generous accessibility or less. We'll talk about a state that has less availability than their states who may have more, but the federal definition of custody is expanded to include probation and parole, supervised release and even unsupervised probation because those are those are controls and restrictions. Even under unsupervised probation. You can have conditions that you're not that the average citizen would have imposed on it was a question has been for a long time is does sex offender registration Unknown 1:26:49 qualify for in custody because you have to be in custody when you bring a habeas petition. You're asking the court order your presence and to give you relief from from a custodial situ Unknown 1:27:00 Well as a fundamental requirement, you have to be in custody before the court to release you from custody. Unknown 1:27:06 So this this individual brought a petition say he was in custody of the sex offender registration and know circuit has recognized that the memory merely registering as a sex offender meets the in custody requirement until the Third Circuit did Unknown 1:27:26 it. That's what makes it so he just we've got a Circuit Court of Appeals saying now that if you want to follow Hey, this petition if you are in custody in Pennsylvania, this was regarding the Pennsylvania registry. That was Holly enhanced in 2012, which has been which has been determined twice now by the Pennsylvania Supreme Court to be punitive and an ex post facto violation but the determination that was punitive Unknown 1:27:57 gave the Third Circuit something to hang their hat on they said why Unknown 1:28:00 Well, it certainly does have a lot of controls that are several of your probation on terms of what you can do and can't do. We're going to provide a link to the decision where everybody can read it. But that the analysis is fantastic because they go through like the internet restrictions that you have under probation and how quickly you have to separate what you have on probation, just having to be registered all those restrictions on how quickly you have to report them and how it deters your usage of online identifiers and creating accounts because it's not practical to report them and so with that said inhibitor and it constraints the person's behavior they go through this beautiful analysis and they say what Charlotte's custody to us Unknown 1:28:40 but they didn't they didn't say what people want it to say I've already had conversations with people so I know what you're going to say to I can challenge doubt where the heaviest well not not so quick because they didn't say that all the states in the third circuit which the Unknown 1:29:00 There's only a few they did say that they're sorta is as unconstitutional they didn't say anything actually they said that the Pennsylvania Supreme Court has given us guidance that they've told us in the case of couple you know and and moved as that they find that Pennsylvania's registry is punitive so we're going to take their word for it and we are going to say that since since the registry is inflicting punished but that that is enough to get you the custody status that you need to follow heaviest petition in Pennsylvania now I don't know that she could make the same argument if you live in Delaware because I don't know if any fighting in Delaware this out the registry to be punitive. Do you remember any such thing I don't I didn't have heard anything coming at a Delaware other than Joe Biden. And I don't remember anything. I don't remember anything. Got a New Jersey finding that the registry inflicts punishment violates the next most Unknown 1:30:00 So we've got a situation here we're in Pennsylvania thanks to to ruins from their state Supreme Court that you've got the opportunity to use the registry as the as the jurisdictional hook to file a petition. That's all this decision said. It didn't say anything more than that. It didn't remember whether the guy should get relief. He doesn't want to be he doesn't want the soup applied to have of what it was. But he did his play in 2010. He didn't have the requirements that were that were added in 2012. So he we don't know if he's going to get that relief or not, at least not through this vehicle. He may get it through the other relief, you know, through the finance case of Unknown 1:30:41 decisions in Pennsylvania. But all this did was directed the trial judge at the district court level to allow him to proceed. When I say this petition, it could be that after he goes through that process, the different judge could say that I target you down for other Unknown 1:31:00 reasons but right he is able to air his grievances and a highest court now if this decision stamps Unknown 1:31:10 does that then open the floodgates for like everyone in Pennsylvania to go File and and, and like gum up the whole system with these Unknown 1:31:19 challenges. It certainly would if I were if I were the Attorney General in Pennsylvania, and if I were even the district courts, the Federal District Courts there would be looking at how many people's on our registry how many of them have been Unknown 1:31:37 working going to have a lot of work to do. And so it would be very surprising to me that if there's not a cert petition to the US Supreme Court to try to to to overturn this decision. I mean, we can't have this flood of atheist petitions coming in here from these people who want don't have to comply with the registry Unknown 1:31:58 then. Unknown 1:32:00 I think I asked you this of handful of days ago then is it we talked about this in potentially finally a challenge in my state of you wouldn't want to bring 808,000 you know whatever individual challenges then you would try and like kind of force the courts hand and make a large decision I don't want to use the word class action suit but that's the concept that I'm thinking of that everybody joins in into one big thing so that there's one big decision made I think you caught it like judicial efficiency or something like that well that's the whole purpose of a class action lawsuit and that may be what they ultimately do in Pennsylvania because it's it's high time that we have a have a report from Pennsylvania and do a conference call about what they've done to has been very little movement to to enact to extend the relief that were was granted the Mendez case beyond the challengers. So if I were the federal courts, I wouldn't want those old challenges flooded into the federal court system. They've got other things I'd rather be doing that Unknown 1:33:00 Dealing with with with with people in the sex offender registry but it does possibly create more pressure to resolve the issue of whether or not the registry needs to be all the people who would fit the same fact pattern that of the bananas case Unknown 1:33:17 relief and that's the whole purpose of the class action has to has to certify something where the claims are similar. And the efficiency is sort of the efficiency of judicial system to resolve to claims collectively rather than going in individually. But I could see potentially a lot of babies petitions if, if if I mean, what what they what Pennsylvania would want to do is they would want to that they would, they would want to go back and ask the Third Circuit, you can ask for a full review and unblock review, you would try to get the full court to flip the panel that it was a three of these these decisions are decided by three judge panel. So you would want to first see if you could if you could flip the panel and by having a novel Unknown 1:34:00 Review they they don't grant for a band those because if they did they'd been appointed splitting of the panels everybody would just go to the full court and the full court could never hear all the cases that they hear it okay so so so you know it's a pretty tough standard to advance the court to convene and to get all think I said 12 to sit as one tribunal and resolve this case like that that's not likely happened but it is an option that would be the first thing they would do it would be to seek a full court review if that fails then they would follow up a petition for sort with the Supreme Court and the meantime they would go back and ask the they would ask the highest court they have asked us about tables court they would ask me the Third Circuit to to stay at further action on this until until they can resolve it because you don't want I mean, how many thousands of people have registered Pennsylvania let's let's just make the assumption. It's 20,000. That seems to be a safe Unknown 1:35:00 Number 20 or 30, 40,000 something in that ballpark yeah you don't you don't want you don't want that Unknown 1:35:07 in the in the court system so this just now they do at the end of the opinion they do they do strive to tell people that this is a narrow Patreon that don't assume anything but people are going to assume a lot of things because because people want people want relief I mean this is this is horrible but if you look at the at the very end of the pain of toward toward the end of it, they do cause of that this is a narrow ruling that they're not they're not trying to encourage the floodgates. Unknown 1:35:40 But why did they even Why did they even grant to hear this particular heaviest case what Well, hey, this is right. So the sum of the parts of the file their biggest addition to the district court level, I had the right to that and you have the right to appeal so this is this is something that they had to hear. Bye bye. Unknown 1:36:00 Right, this is not they didn't get their choice so that they could have ruled against it. But they but they okay. persuaded by the arguments Unknown 1:36:08 okay all right so I mean you could file ABS for anything and be like this doesn't apply so no well that's what the district courts and the magistrate so I guess kind of like granting cert so you you'd find a cert petition to ask perfectly will Hey will SCOTUS Will you guys please hear this thing and they just say no that's similar to this you you have the right to file it but they can say no well no they have to hear your name is they have to they have to they have to make a decision on your a business that they can get you like a fish Unknown 1:36:37 okay but but they do have to decide your your petition unless you're outside the balance of being eligible for haggis they had always got it days by simply say you're not eligible for this relief because you're not in custody Unknown 1:36:50 which is directly to so what are the basic requirements to file well you have you have to you have to be in custody of some form if you're on file Unknown 1:37:00 Federal he has to be in either present or under supervised release, probation, parole or something where they are, they have significant control over your daily lives. And that and that's where this kicks in. Okay. And because I'm assuming that the people that are filing this are outside of that, but because of the restrictions of the registry, internet restrictions or living restriction, etc, it starts to look like custody, correct. They have determined that with all the restrictions, a Pennsylvania could not help themselves, they kept piling on restrictions, like a lot of other states. And since since they couldn't help themselves they follow they've got a court to say, well, Unknown 1:37:40 we hate to do this, but this sure looks like custody at us. So therefore, this is already available to them. Now, the supreme court could do like they did in them in this case, they could they could refuse to hear this Unknown 1:37:53 it's hard to speculate on what the Supreme Court is going to do because I don't have a direct pipeline to them if they were to affirm Unknown 1:38:00 This ruling this would open up the entire nation for people to use hey this as a vehicle to challenge aspects of registration I can't imagine the Supreme Court would want to do that Unknown 1:38:14 right Unknown 1:38:17 wow this is so in the weeds stuff again this is this is like big propeller head legal stuff of like where this fits in threading the needle it's just it's funky To me it's fascinating and it's just this is weird stuff I can't imagine that they would want to flood the courts with with haters petitions. So it might be that their best strategy would be to Supreme Court would be doing the same thing they did. It says the same thing they did adults versus director Michigan is to reject the cert petition which would leave a limited ruling within three states and particular with the way that they narrowed it they have basically made this only applicable to Pennsylvania they said many of our sister This is unlimited. How many of our sister circuit separate predicted that a ruling such as this one but Unknown 1:39:00 We announced today would would render the customer requirement Fabius statute superfluous our decision today raises no such concerns we do not hold that any collateral consequences of conviction can support as jurisdiction rather we hold that the custodial jurisdiction requirement is satisfied by severe immediate physical and according to the states on definition punitive restraints they made the state Supreme Court on liberty that are imposed pursuant to an included in the judgment of the state court which is the one here truly collateral consequences such as the inability to vote engage in certain businesses hold public office of servers at your are not analogous to the restrictive and base appreciate created under soreness registration requirements so right don't get yourself all palpitating because they didn't say anything will trigger the in custody a definition did you beat that that definition they said that in a state where the Supreme Court has said that the registry is punitive and you have all Unknown 1:40:00 These restrictions which we've outlined in this routing, including the the internet restrictions, that that might be enough to trigger the in custody analysis that you could actually meet it. That's all they've said here, right? So like, it's okay, the best thing for the Supreme Court to do would probably be to say, we don't want to have certain to die. Unknown 1:40:23 And then Pennsylvania will have to clean up his act and decide how they're going to implement what the Supreme Court has said is a punish as a punitive regime, and they're gonna have to fix that. Unknown 1:40:34 I think it's, I think it's additional, I think it's additional leverage to get Pennsylvania's problems fixed, Unknown 1:40:40 right? And then if you find states that have similar regimes, that you could then use this to push your argument up the ladder where you have a more lenient state then you just have less grounds to stand on to try and do this, but if you have, I'm thinking Oklahoma just because we covered the article we have the frickin tax quality. Unknown 1:41:00 Front door that feels like custody. Unknown 1:41:04 Sure does. Unknown 1:41:06 And you know, there was the thing in the different videos that David Fargo has put out where the woman, she, hey, tomorrow, you can't go to the park anymore that feels like custody does Unknown 1:41:18 so you know, it feels. So here, here's where we can keep building on the mountain of if you're in a state that has these things, here's the elements that you can pull in to build up your little sandcastle for you to start trying to try and knock some of these things down. And let's just say it again. Each state has their own registry scheme and each state has to be fought individually but other states can give you tools for us to go fight there but again there's not going to be that one magic bullets going to take down the whole thing there's never going to be a magic bullet ever that will take down the whole thing unless we choose through a political process to stop doing this. There's there's no court ruling that will take down Unknown 1:42:00 The whole thing Unknown 1:42:01 ever, ever ever I hear you well, I like their conclusion. The writ of habeas corpus quote is not now and never has been a static arrow formula stick remedy, the scope of the writ has grown in accordance with its purpose to protect individuals against the erosion of their right to be feet free from wrongful restraints upon Liberty source registration requirements clearly constitute are straight up on liberty, a physical restraint not shared by the public generally. Unknown 1:42:29 So they're telling you that hey, just that you look at you look at a state like Arkansas you have to be a physical custody to file a state atheists there. They take a much narrower view of habeas corpus down then the feds if you're not in a physical custody you will not be heard in a state haters proceeding and working so Unknown 1:42:51 it feels to me like in many of these states, they are aggressive about this stuff because they have an enlarged medulla oblong got up. Unknown 1:43:01 It's an area of the brain like it like alligators, they're aggressive because they have an enlarged like the center of their brain. It's just like it but there are certain people that are just aggressive because maybe they have Unknown 1:43:12 just like BP their brain is wired wrong. Unknown 1:43:16 I never ever do or what that word was like you learn me something a little peanut it's the little walnut sized like sending your brain is the fight or flight section of your brain. Alright, appreciate that. You're welcome. That's why I'm here because I don't know the legal stuff but give me some bowls crazy kind of trivia out there. Maybe I know something Unknown 1:43:36 how I'm give me give me your opinion on like the larger scheme of things. Does this literally only apply in Pennsylvania? Or does it like start to spread out and get used elsewhere? I would. I would say that literally it only applies to Pennsylvania. In reality. If if the Supreme Court were to get a cert petition and if they were to deny review of this case the slaves go Unknown 1:44:00 springing it's it's you're going to be seeing people argue this all over the country that they're going to cite to this as a persuasive circuit court opinion well reason well analyzed well thought out and they're going to say that this is persuasive authority and other circuits that try to get those circuits to expand the definition of in custody to include Unknown 1:44:22 sort of I just can't imagine that you wouldn't that would be the logical thing you would do. Unknown 1:44:27 Right? Okay. Unknown 1:44:29 Wow. All right. Well, we're at like an hour and a half hour and 40 minutes so let's, let's shut it down. Well, I think we should so how do we how do we how do we get in touch with our people who are out there listening by the thousands? How do they get in touch with us? You know, Unknown 1:44:44 it almost seems like a chicken and the egg thing they're if they're already listening to us, then they know how to find us. But please tell all the people that you know go to Google Duck Duck go being Ask Jeeves. I don't know all of them and say and type in registry matters and you can find the website which is registry matters.ca. Unknown 1:45:00 That is where we live. That's where the podcast is produced and released and all that stuff. But you can also find it on iTunes, Google place. I don't do it on Stitcher. Um, anyway, you can find it all those places. Unknown 1:45:13 And your favorite thing is tell them about the phone number. Yes. I would love to get more phone calls. Just keep them kind of short. So we don't have to have people fall asleep. But. But leave a message and 747 to 274477 and we will play it if and if it's if it's coherent, Unknown 1:45:34 yes, I think you should get equipment, like mangler does in chat, and he has incredible equipment and sounds very smooth and buttery. Unknown 1:45:45 All right. What about an email, send in some email messages? That would be registry matters cast at gmail. com. Unknown 1:45:53 Awesome. And then if people the very generous ones want to support us on Patreon, where do they go? Unknown 1:45:59 Thanks. Unknown 1:46:00 to their bank and find out how much they have in the account. Oh my god, we're out to how much you have in your Well, actually that good? Hey, look, Americans generally have what? $400 in savings. If they had a $400 car bill, they couldn't pay it. So that might not be the best approach. Unknown 1:46:15 So now you go to what is it? You go to Unknown 1:46:19 patreon.com slash register slash registry matters. And yeah, and you can find an option as little as $1 and dollar a month, it will come out on the date you designate. And it will come in and it will it will just be so flattering to see our number of patrons go up from 30 we want to we want to be over 100 by the end of the year well that gives you a gore Bassam it would definitely if we were over 100 patrons by the end of the year it would give me a core basil even if they were all one hour absolutely outstanding. And and we have a bunch of people in chat tonight harassing me while we were recording this in the live stream. So if you want to go there you can find a link in the show notes but it's we have a Discord server if you want. Unknown 1:47:00 hang out and you can talk before and afterwards, possibly not during, but maybe you could ask a live question. If you had something that was worthwhile, we might put you on Live on the Air and all that. And with that layer, there's, there's There are dozens of people in here tonight. Thank you for listening to the point. With that, I bid you adieu and I hope you have a wonderful night and watch out for those crazy legislators because they're all scummy. Thank you and good night. Unknown 1:47:24 Bye there. Transcribed by https://otter.ai